Grain farms anyone?

[DezNutz]

Ok lets take a look at your tools requiring food and iron. Tools sell at 16-18. Iron sells at 9-11 and food sells at 4-6. Which means you need to spend atleast 13-17gc in resources. You cut your profit margin to nothing.

But your assuming that 1 tool requires 1 iron and 1 food to make. This doesn't HAVE to be the case. For example we could make it to where 1 iron and 1 food makes 10 tools. Or 1 to 5 ratio or some other formula that could be discussed. It won't be hard to figure out a way to make it to where tools need iron and food to be produced and keeping it profitable, just need to find a good ratio to keep it profitable, but not by too much.

I would agree with that if these were a hideout buildings. But these are not hideout buildings that everyone will be able to use when they want.

Okay so what I don't understand is how a grain farm would improve the stock in a food port. If I own a food plantation I would never sell my produce in that port, I would simply devote some ships to taking it wherever it sells for the most profit. I'm not sure I understand the mechanics of these plantations. Would they automatically sell to the port and then the port sells again? Or is it stored in my warehouse after production? Are the plantations expected to act as a supplement to the port so that some players are pulling from there own production rather than the ports?

As each resource can only be be produced in 3 ports. Those producing it can only supply to those 3 ports. These aren't hideout buildings like the GoldSmith. Take everything you know about GoldSmiths and throw it out of the window when discussing this.

[Meliva]

Okay so what I don't understand is how a grain farm would improve the stock in a food port. If I own a food plantation I would never sell my produce in that port, I would simply devote some ships to taking it wherever it sells for the most profit. I'm not sure I understand the mechanics of these plantations. Would they automatically sell to the port and then the port sells again? Or is it stored in my warehouse after production? Are the plantations expected to act as a supplement to the port so that some players are pulling from there own production rather than the ports?

I think the basic idea is that the governor of a port will get a cut of the plantation profits, and the plantation owners production goes to the port for a price. I assume that it will be low pay but high volume. Like lets say a plantation sells its food for 4 coins-a very low amount, but the plantation will produce a good amount of food to sell to make It worth it. But that's just what I think it will be like. It may not be decided yet though.

[Shadowood]

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=3706&p=52498&hilit=Plantations#p52494

Here is the link to Plantations idea and metrics... Some might want to re-read it and apply it here.

Of course this is not set in stone and we need a few more details from CJ.

I just don't see where the profits are, just yet.

My current concern is Party Card Routes. During the beginning, while players are "building up", I see a stall out of production to keep up on demand in busy ports, like Psaral-Akro.

[Captain Jack]

It's nice to see you get into the very same thoughts we had.

Let me provide some insight for the questions around Goroum:
-There are still some Fertile Lands around, players who have been around here must have used them in Goroum after this discussion. I know I used one mysel, one must used one more. Generally, do not expect us to cast any more of them or taint the numbers. Our focus is to provide the tools,not to save Goroum.

-Trade overview could help to determine how many food crates are actually moved. The court page mentions arriving fleets. Which could bring in anything really and could take out again anything. From what I see, food consumption is Goroum should be lower but it surely needs a lot of monitoring as many players might be filling warehouses.


Regarding Grain Farms, they will be a variation of Plantations. Plantations is the basic feature. The basic functionality will be the same although there will be slight diversifications in operation. This is no change of the original plan. The same will happen with Mines etc. They will just be a little different (not only in name) but the basic requirements (ie permission, acres) will be the same.

The change right now is that Food plantations, aka Grain Plantations (or Grain Farms, sounds better I think) will also debut alongside with tobacco, rum and cotton. The reason is no other than necessity.

The major importance here though, is for everyone to get an idea of the new reality that is starting to take shape before us. In the beginning, there will be limitations; for example, plantations of rum will only be possible in rum ports. But what of the future? This can change later.

It cannot change outright. We first need to create consumption of resources relative to the world stats and player count. Population will solve this. Maintaining 2.1 Billion population ports will really seem like impossible once this population will have need for food and the rest of the fine products that Avonmora will produce.

Once enough necessity for resources is created, we will be able to retire certain cards, like the party cards. Once party cards are removed, then we will be able to allow any plantations on a port. Once this is possible, we will be able to completely free every port market to buy and sell every resource.

[Shadowood]

It cannot change outright. We first need to create consumption of resources relative to the world stats and player count. Population will solve this. Maintaining 2.1 Billion population ports will really seem like impossible once this population will have need for food and the rest of the fine products that Avonmora will produce.

Would the old tax rate come back if this is the case?

Once enough necessity for resources is created, we will be able to retire certain cards, like the party cards. Once party cards are removed, then we will be able to allow any plantations on a port. Once this is possible, we will be able to completely free every port market to buy and sell every resource.

My mind just blew and a little pee came out... not gonna lie.

[sXs]

It cannot change outright. We first need to create consumption of resources relative to the world stats and player count. Population will solve this. Maintaining 2.1 Billion population ports will really seem like impossible once this population will have need for food and the rest of the fine products that Avonmora will produce.

I am re-reading original plantation post. Is this population aspect going to attached to player demand for resources or port population demand? Or will the two be tied together?

My train of thought here is this. Instead of black death voodoo to reduce an enemy port population, you could simply cause a temporary artificial demand in a port. Send all your trade fleets into a port to drain it of food for example.

Short food supply would cause over populated port to go hungry thus reducing population?

This only works if demand is tied both to population demand and player demand for trade goods.

Does this make sense?

[sXs]

Easier way to explain what I am thinking. Right now port population does not consume market goods. If we tied port population into the consumption of market goods as well as player demand, then my above post makes sense.

[DezNutz]

Spoiler: show

It's nice to see you get into the very same thoughts we had.

Let me provide some insight for the questions around Goroum:
-There are still some Fertile Lands around, players who have been around here must have used them in Goroum after this discussion. I know I used one mysel, one must used one more. Generally, do not expect us to cast any more of them or taint the numbers. Our focus is to provide the tools,not to save Goroum.

-Trade overview could help to determine how many food crates are actually moved. The court page mentions arriving fleets. Which could bring in anything really and could take out again anything. From what I see, food consumption is Goroum should be lower but it surely needs a lot of monitoring as many players might be filling warehouses.


Regarding Grain Farms, they will be a variation of Plantations. Plantations is the basic feature. The basic functionality will be the same although there will be slight diversifications in operation. This is no change of the original plan. The same will happen with Mines etc. They will just be a little different (not only in name) but the basic requirements (ie permission, acres) will be the same.

The change right now is that Food plantations, aka Grain Plantations (or Grain Farms, sounds better I think) will also debut alongside with tobacco, rum and cotton. The reason is no other than necessity.

The major importance here though, is for everyone to get an idea of the new reality that is starting to take shape before us. In the beginning, there will be limitations; for example, plantations of rum will only be possible in rum ports. But what of the future? This can change later.

It cannot change outright. We first need to create consumption of resources relative to the world stats and player count. Population will solve this. Maintaining 2.1 Billion population ports will really seem like impossible once this population will have need for food and the rest of the fine products that Avonmora will produce.

Once enough necessity for resources is created, we will be able to retire certain cards, like the party cards. Once party cards are removed, then we will be able to allow any plantations on a port. Once this is possible, we will be able to completely free every port market to buy and sell every resource.

For the most part I agree. However, I don't see any need to have a variation of Plantations for Food Production. A plantation grows crops: Food (Grain/Corn, etc.), Cotton, and Tobacco. Rum is not a crop, it is a manufactured good, like Iron and Tools, it should require its own building. And before anyone says that Iron is not a manufactured good. You can't take Iron Ore (which is what you mine) and use it directly. It must be processed in a blast-furnace to create Iron (Pig-iron).

What crop the plantation grows and sells should depend on the port it is located in. I have some reservations on the plantations being in every port down the road and choosing different crops to produce other than the ports defined resource. I'll post them on the other topic.

Have we done a cost analysis? The main topic lists that full metrics will be released, but I don't see them.

[OG Deadking]

I'm confused, can we jsut keep Avonmora the way it is, this is just starting to get a wee bit over complicated

[sXs]

I'm confused, can we jsut keep Avonmora the way it is, this is just starting to get a wee bit over complicated

Just pop a few MoW in a fleet and send them out trading.

That will help you understand....lol