Witch Doctors gameplay - manageable risk for everyone

[Sir Thalius Hayle]

I don't think everything should be available to buy, some things you have to earn...

Like MC you could phase that out, and every 100 wins that ship is included in, it earns a attribute point. Will get people to bring out there Sotls, too. This way, people do not need a research academy to add attributes; all they need is to pull their finger out and attack folk on the plunderboard.

Not sure if you meant this literally, but I would rather not see ships get attribute points for every x battles they are involved in. Players will simply put ships in strong fleets and then grind them out on the plunder boards until they are leveled up.

I would suggest something more like experience points are applied to a fleet that is involved in a battle, and then divided up between the ships that were actually involved in the fight. Areas that experience would be handed out for would be things like ships that deal the most damage in the battle, have the finishing blow, or even those ships that defend against the most damage on the defending side would get experience points applied to those areas.

Ships (or rather their captains), would acquire experience points based on their actual experience in battles, whether offense or defense. Once enough experience in a given area is racked up, the captain acquires a point toward that attribute. Ship position would then become important in a fleet, based on the experience the player is trying to accrue for a given captain.

In this system the players would not simply choose were the experience point goes- they would have to use their ships in a way that the captain they are leveling up earns it in battle.

This customization would be separate from tech and research that would yield other benefits and customization of a player's ship attributes. What I have addressed here pertains only to an experience system for captains.

Respectfully submitted..

~TH~

[PhoenixKnight]

Ships attributes and strength should come from a mixture of things. Shipwright, captain and crew

[DezNutz]

Ships attributes and strength should come from a mixture of things. Shipwright, captain and crew

Yes, that could work if each of those had their own individual attributes that you could level up via training and experience. For instance:

The more times you build a SOTL, the better the base attributes it has each build. Crew and captain attributes would be individual and would be improved via training and experience. You could also hire crew specifically that have some attributes but it would come at a higher cost.

[Redish]

I don't think everything should be available to buy, some things you have to earn...

Like MC you could phase that out, and every 100 wins that ship is included in, it earns a attribute point. Will get people to bring out there Sotls, too. This way, people do not need a research academy to add attributes; all they need is to pull their finger out and attack folk on the plunderboard.

This isn't really practical. A lot of effort has gone into developing Metallurgy & Gunpowder research and these are only effective with 50-60 point ships. That means MC cards.

Sabotage cards destroy those attribute points and when you're dealing with a vindictive voodoo god it actually pointless doing that research or upgrading your ships to that level.

Another thing that effectively cancels the effect of Metallurgy and Gunpowder tech is the Levi cards. By using Spanish galleon tech plus these two techs and then using MC's to make use of that research you can upgrade a Flag Galleon to be just as strong as a SOTL. For pirates this is ideal because they can then take out the SOTL escort ships on trade fleets making these invincible traders vulnerable. The problem is that this trader will the simply launch 10 or even 40 levi's to sink those Flags in one go. So what is the point of researching Gunpowder & Metallurgy techs and building up ships if you have a card that can destroy them so easily? This would also a apply to any other ship ugraded to make use of the techs

I'm not saying that ships are to given absolute protection but the power of some cards need to be curbed. Perhaps another method could be to either place a cap on the amount of cards or types of cards a single player can hold. In a recent 'war' I think I saw one instance where a player had something like 13000 cards (My memory could be letting me down but I think it was around there)

We need voodoo in the game as it is a good credit sinker and that keeps Admin smiling. What we need do is stop the bullying by large established players.

What I think we need is to allow players who choose to stay small to take the punishment that these voodoo gods throw at them without being absolutely destroyed. Perhaps some sort of voodoo protection (less chance of successful casts) for pirates with less than 20 ships. You could even make this applicable to specific voodoo cards only. In the case of traders you could perhaps say FUGS will be less effective if a player has between 250 and 500 ships. Grow any bigger and you lose the protection (Probably a silly example but something down this line could be a solution).

[DezNutz]

I don't think everything should be available to buy, some things you have to earn...

Like MC you could phase that out, and every 100 wins that ship is included in, it earns a attribute point. Will get people to bring out there Sotls, too. This way, people do not need a research academy to add attributes; all they need is to pull their finger out and attack folk on the plunderboard.

This isn't really practical. A lot of effort has gone into developing Metallurgy & Gunpowder research and these are only effective with 50-60 point ships. That means MC cards.

Sabotage cards destroy those attribute points and when you're dealing with a vindictive voodoo god it actually pointless doing that research or upgrading your ships to that level.

Another thing that effectively cancels the effect of Metallurgy and Gunpowder tech is the Levi cards. By using Spanish galleon tech plus these two techs and then using MC's to make use of that research you can upgrade a Flag Galleon to be just as strong as a SOTL. For pirates this is ideal because they can then take out the SOTL escort ships on trade fleets making these invincible traders vulnerable. The problem is that this trader will the simply launch 10 or even 40 levi's to sink those Flags in one go. So what is the point of researching Gunpowder & Metallurgy techs and building up ships if you have a card that can destroy them so easily? This would also a apply to any other ship ugraded to make use of the techs

I'm not saying that ships are to given absolute protection but the power of some cards need to be curbed. Perhaps another method could be to either place a cap on the amount of cards or types of cards a single player can hold. In a recent 'war' I think I saw one instance where a player had something like 13000 cards (My memory could be letting me down but I think it was around there)

We need voodoo in the game as it is a good credit sinker and that keeps Admin smiling. What we need do is stop the bullying by large established players.

What I think we need is to allow players who choose to stay small to take the punishment that these voodoo gods throw at them without being absolutely destroyed. Perhaps some sort of voodoo protection (less chance of successful casts) for pirates with less than 20 ships. You could even make this applicable to specific voodoo cards only. In the case of traders you could perhaps say FUGS will be less effective if a player has between 250 and 500 ships. Grow any bigger and you lose the protection (Probably a silly example but something down this line could be a solution).

You don't need a 60 attribute ship to make Gunpowder Tech effective. Nor do you need a 60 attribute ship for Metallurgy Tech, although in most cases (depending on attribute distribution) iron scantling is one ofthe last to be filled, so a ship with full attributes would make the most of this tech.

As well, by phasing out certain voodoo such as MC, attribute allocation will make a difference and start to matter more in battles. Currently, almost anyone can get a 60 att ship. Maxed stat ships should be rare and difficult to get.

[Grimrock Litless]

Just make a fleet with 5 60 att sotl. That would be good, or you can have 5 60 att MoW, oh wait, voodoo would make them pointless.
Anyone know what else would become pointless because of voodoo? Yeah, almost everything.

[Sebena]

There is simple solution for this... make more levels for the ships but the catch is any lvl above lvl 10 needs to be earned by fighting... no MC or levi affecting it... for example I make 60 pointer friggy with cards and gold and after fighting it goes on lvl 12 with 2 new att points.... someone is pissed at me and uses levis he can use 10 only those 2 stay there ship is not sank and again only 10 levels is possible to raise...

[Bmw]

There is simple solution for this... make more levels for the ships but the catch is any lvl above lvl 10 needs to be earned by fighting... no MC or levi affecting it... for example I make 60 pointer friggy with cards and gold and after fighting it goes on lvl 12 with 2 new att points.... someone is pissed at me and uses levis he can use 10 only those 2 stay there ship is not sank and again only 10 levels is possible to raise...

so basically 10 lvl's and then 10 special attributes and one of those can be unsinkable by levi's

[Grimrock Litless]

There is simple solution for this... make more levels for the ships but the catch is any lvl above lvl 10 needs to be earned by fighting... no MC or levi affecting it... for example I make 60 pointer friggy with cards and gold and after fighting it goes on lvl 12 with 2 new att points.... someone is pissed at me and uses levis he can use 10 only those 2 stay there ship is not sank and again only 10 levels is possible to raise...

This idea is already out there, just no one cared about it, or that people did, but already forgot.

[Kangaroo]

Ahoy everyone,

We do not really like the Witch Doctor gameplay, where one man sits behind his inventory and uses his voodoo at will, without anything to lose.

This is an old issue. First serious reference dates 2 years ago @ viewtopic.php?f=5&t=1623

A suggestion that attempted to control the problem, came 2 months later than the post above:
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=1747&p=20315#p20315

None was approved or implemented though. The key reason is that probably none of the ideas was good enough.

This time, we need to approach the case differently as this is something that expands to more cases. Ships is not the issue. Risk is the issue. There needs to always be some risk to everyone.

just a reminder, the OP isn't simply about the effects of Voodoo on PVP, it's primarily about the use of voodoo without risk.