Pirate Rankings and Bonuses

[DezNutz]

I see your point Deez. The life of a pirate should be difficult. I don't think Vane is arguing that point. It should be the most difficult path chosen. But by choosing the most difficult path, shouldn't the reward be greater? Where is the reward for choosing the path of a pirate?

What do pirates get for success? As much as you hate to keep hearing the Trades Glory moniker for the game, that is what it is becoming. Early on I talked to vets about becoming a pirate, and they were the ones that admitted to me that this was the path of the game. I didn't come up with the moniker.

Vane is trying to do the very thing you claim the title of the game dictates and just asking for a few tweaks, not to make the life of a pirate easy or advantageous, but to make the life of a pirate possible.

I have doubts about that you seeing my point. It isn't Trader's Glory, nor is it heading in that way. Anyone saying it should take a real hard look at the game dynamics. Piracy is hard as it should be, but it isn't impossible. Mercantilism is easy, as it should be. Game features should be available and developed for both sides; however, care needs to be placed in that features should not make piracy easy, nor make it impossible. Giving some buffs to piracy is fine, as I said before, as long as they don't give an undue advantage to the point where piracy is an easy street.

Danik made an excellent point. If piracy becomes easy, large merchants will slowly vanish. Merchants understand the risks of being a merchant and getting attacked by pirates. It is an expectation of the game. However, if piracy becomes easy, merchants will minimize risks by reducing fleet sizes and/or start trading with fleets that aren't easy to plunder, thus making piracy even harder. It is a delicate balance.

[ChaIbaud]

Personally I understand Piracy must be hard because too much power and benefits to this lifestyle will cause the scale to (for once) tip in favor of pirates. The thing for me is Piracy IS already hard and we aren't asking for a game-changing update to revolutionize pirate mechanics. Just a little benefit to become a more viable option in the game. Maybe if Pirates don't get an update, mercantilism will become harder. I'd like to see you guys have to fill out spreadsheets and set prices and not be able to make a profit on any route. Maybe you could begin to lose money. Perhaps decrease resources or have to perform maintenance on your ships after every few port stops. Possibly have to gain a certain influence in the port to buy over a certain amount of resources. Of course these won't be implemented because the majority of the players will be affected in what they think as a negative way. The same is true with pirate updates: the majority will be scared to lose their established position because those who can take away their money will be a tiny bit more powerful.

[DezNutz]

Personally I understand Piracy must be hard because too much power and benefits to this lifestyle will cause the scale to (for once) tip in favor of pirates. The thing for me is Piracy IS already hard and we aren't asking for a game-changing update to revolutionize pirate mechanics. Just a little benefit to become a more viable option in the game. Maybe if Pirates don't get an update, mercantilism will become harder. I'd like to see you guys have to fill out spreadsheets and set prices and not be able to make a profit on any route. Maybe you could begin to lose money. Perhaps decrease resources or have to perform maintenance on your ships after every few port stops. Possibly have to gain a certain influence in the port to buy over a certain amount of resources. Of course these won't be implemented because the majority of the players will be affected in what they think as a negative way. The same is true with pirate updates: the majority will be scared to lose their established position because those who can take away their money will be a tiny bit more powerful.

If mercantilism was difficult, this game would collapse. There would be fewer merchants, thus fewer available targets for pirates.

[sXs]

Tell me how any of the changes in this suggestion upset that balance?

[DezNutz]

Tell me how any of the changes in this suggestion upset that balance?

I wasn't arguing against this suggestion. I was arguing the fact that this isn't Traders Glory, but since you think I was, I will point out part of the suggestion that is bad.

Turnless skirmish.

Turns are the most important feature in the game. They are even more important since the admins put limits on them. They are required for almost every action. You can't transfer gold coin, build ships, cast voodoo, relationships, treasure hunting, hasten hideout buildings/research, plunder, etc without turns. Giving pirates the ability to use a function without turn costs while everyone else still has to use them, is an unfair advantage, that makes piracy significantly easier.

[sXs]

Daily livlihod of a pirate is skirmish and plunder. If you are against turnless skirmish then why are turns not required for trade routes?

The offset proposed of diminished returns helps to prevent an unending skirmish attack, and the danger incurred is also a deterence.

[DezNutz]

Daily livlihod of a pirate is skirmish and plunder. If you are against turnless skirmish then why are turns not required for trade routes?

The offset proposed of diminished returns helps to prevent an unending skirmish attack, and the danger incurred is also a deterence.

Pirates aren't the sole users of Plunder and Skirmish. Do you pay attention to the plunder board?

Pirates also use trade routes, you aren't likely to find a pirate that doesn't have a trade route setup. I'll concede that pirates can have turnless skirmish, if pirates can't have trade routes.

Ask the former Pirate Roberts (Admiral Nelson / John Avery) about how much danger rating is a deterrence to pirates. There is a forum topic that states something like he had over 1000 danger points. There are players that are non-pirates that have war fleets with hundreds of danger points on them. I'm not a pirate, and I've had my war fleet on the plunder board with over a hundred danger.

[Maha]

Pirates also use trade routes, you aren't likely to find a pirate that doesn't have a trade route setup. I'll concede that pirates can have turnless skirmish, if pirates can't have trade routes.

Ask the former Pirate Roberts (Admiral Nelson / John Avery) about how much danger rating is a deterrence to pirates. There is a forum topic that states something like he had over 1000 danger points. There are players that are non-pirates that have war fleets with hundreds of danger points on them. I'm not a pirate, and I've had my war fleet on the plunder board with over a hundred danger.

pirates need a few trade ships to supply their hideout. but why must a pirate be a merchant to be able to improve? to be able to develop his strength and abilities?

if the income side is not to be touched, what about the expense side? will a pirate get a boon there?

i understand that trade should be easy and lucrative to attract the mindless mass ( ) but piracy should be possible without the need to join their trade.

[DezNutz]

I was solely trying to prove a point. Trade is a necessity for all players. You can't build ships without it unless you have credits to buy from the market.

[ChaIbaud]

The name is, indeed, Pirates Glory but saying it isn't very biased towards Merchant currently is ignorant in my opinion. My point stating that if Piracy wasn't going to get even a bit easier, mercantilism should get harder is one that you shouldn't dismiss with such a general statement even though most of it was just a polarizing example. The fact of the matter is that being a merchant involves making a fleet, clicking a couple of times, and getting massive returns; whereas, pirates have to limit their ship counts and run the danger up, risking infinitely more for a small piece of the pie, saving up voodoo and turning profits into investments just to keep going on day-to-day. The simplicity of trading is astounding and commitment to it means massive profit. Logistically, piracy should be easier because of how established even mediocre merchants are. And to get back on the original post, not all features have to be just as SHM described: they are meant to be debated and either approved or denied based on changes others think would be appropriate.

It is wholly biased and unfair to say that Piracy is in a good spot in status-quo. To quote something most likely said by Chin Chin during the US Elections last year, "the rich get richer and the poor get poorer." I understand to be a pirate means you live the hard life and choose to be secluded from massive income daily but at its current state the game discourages my preferred type of gameplay because there are no significant benefits to being a true pirate besides getting to be exempt from what little taxes you would have to pay should you be in a nation. The balance of the game is completely in ruins and will continue to be so until players halt from saying something needs to change but deny any attempt to move forward and sacrifice their almost guaranteed safety and allow for other play styles to be viable as well.