Guild banks and membership

[sXs]

This is about allowing a guild to have traders, privateers and wealth managers, and as I said previously, it's about a guild being able to put resources in the hands of their members who can utilise them best.

"put resources in the hands of their members who can utilise them best."

You cant have authorised access to a unified group bank account atm, nor can you store voodoo or credits in one to be drawn upon as required

", by authorised people within a group."

The abiity to levy an entry, plus ongoing contributions, along with the ability to donate credits and cards would be a significant enhancement of guild importance and activity.
.

"donate credits and cards"

DONATE!!!

these are the things I am arguing against.

[sXs]

Guilds will have banks that are managed by the Guildmaster, treasurer and one other selected member.

Contribution to the bank at will is permitted but withdrawal must happen by one of the 3 officers.

Guilds can specify membership fees paid per day/week/biweekly/Monthly at the beginning of the period. Payments are automatic and in the form of credits, gc, gold bars or all the above.

Gains received by guild members whether plunder, trade, player to member are subject to a defined share % payable to the guild bank automatically.

The guilds can set these to 0 or set a number to them.

Phoenix OP

"Contribution"

"withdrawal must happen by one of the 3 officers"

This is what I am arguing against.

[sXs]

I am fine with fees, taxes, and set amounts..... but no way on the voluntary contributions.

What would stop someone from depositing their entire Voodoo collection or treasury in a guild bank then. I am arguing against the stated intents of this suggestion..... not the inferential intents of others.

[Sir Henry Morgan]

I still believe a Guild Bank is unnecessary, convolutes the game and reduces the true strength of a guild.

Due to the nature of the guild design, it is a dictatorship - the Guildmaster has all of the political power - any other political power others have is bestowed upon others by the guild master.

If a "storage of guild treasures - voodoo cards, gold coin, bars, credits or whatever - is approved, it would ultimately be under the control and protection of the guild master. Anyone else with access would have access by the permission of the guildmaster.

This could work like a bank, but without the protections of a bank. This feature should be a guild treasury, and subject to being pillaged, plundered and attacked by any player. Its defense would depend upon the protections put in place of the guild master. If the guild master has a mindbar, the guild treasury is protected. If the guildmaster is under a Blacklist curse, no one can access the guild treasury.

As I see it, a guild "bank" is a multi-player mechanism which can easily be exploited.

The guild system would have to be totally re-designed - a time consuming project, and changes the guild into a feature similar to the nations feature - it would change the character and social aspects of the guild.

I believe flagships, blockades, and other current nation features will do more for the game rhan this feature.

[Shadowood]

To be honest...

There are several games out there that have a GUILD BANK. However they are not used like how things are suggested now.

People can contribute to the guild bank for the guild to gain/purchase Guild Based Bonues. Guild Based Bonues are not a new idea in the game world and they have been suggested before ( viewtopic.php?f=4&t=3802&p=54983&hilit=guild+based+bonus#p54983 )

I see a system like this that could work.

[sXs]

I still believe a Guild Bank is unnecessary, convolutes the game and reduces the true strength of a guild.

Due to the nature of the guild design, it is a dictatorship - the Guildmaster has all of the political power - any other political power others have is bestowed upon others by the guild master.

If a "storage of guild treasures - voodoo cards, gold coin, bars, credits or whatever - is approved, it would ultimately be under the control and protection of the guild master. Anyone else with access would have access by the permission of the guildmaster.

This could work like a bank, but without the protections of a bank. This feature should be a guild treasury, and subject to being pillaged, plundered and attacked by any player. Its defense would depend upon the protections put in place of the guild master. If the guild master has a mindbar, the guild treasury is protected. If the guildmaster is under a Blacklist curse, no one can access the guild treasury.

As I see it, a guild "bank" is a multi-player mechanism which can easily be exploited.

The guild system would have to be totally re-designed - a time consuming project, and changes the guild into a feature similar to the nations feature - it would change the character and social aspects of the guild.

I believe flagships, blockades, and other current nation features will do more for the game rhan this feature.

Thank you for expressing everything I have said in a much more eloquent fashion than i could could have ever hoped to do myself.

[Stan Rogers]

Well, its a topic that comes to light every now and again I think it could improve guild interaction, promote more new player guild admittance, lend to a guild a greater sense of kinship.
I'm sure somewhere, there are players who could and would exploit any holes that is usually present in any give or take situation as a sword cuts both ways usually.
In my opinion the bonuses gained would outweigh any holes that come with a plan. As I mentioned, a tweak of banking rules allowing joint account ownership should not be that hard to code.
Having that ability solves all the arguments of exploitation, milking, pushing and everything else if the depositor had to agree on their contribution being withdrawn.

Perhaps if some valid arguments were presented on how such a system could be exploited, please explain it in layman's terms to a dummy like me.

[sXs]

Well, its a topic that comes to light every now and again I think it could improve guild interaction, promote more new player guild admittance, lend to a guild a greater sense of kinship.
I'm sure somewhere, there are players who could and would exploit any holes that is usually present in any give or take situation as a sword cuts both ways usually.
In my opinion the bonuses gained would outweigh any holes that come with a plan. As I mentioned, a tweak of banking rules allowing joint account ownership should not be that hard to code.
Having that ability solves all the arguments of exploitation, milking, pushing and everything else if the depositor had to agree on their contribution being withdrawn.

Perhaps if some valid arguments were presented on how such a system could be exploited, please explain it in layman's terms to a dummy like me.

Sure. I am going to retire. I open joint account with someone and give them authorization to withdraw.

They withdraw entire amount and close account.

I am not against a guild bank at all. I am against it as it is proposed. Donation based could too easily be exploited.

A fee based structure that was equal for all members except maybe a grace period for new players would be fine. Combined with Shadows "Guild Tech Tree" suggestion or Wills "Guild booster" suggestion, then it gets in line with something like what other games have.

But to allow an unfettered donation type system just will not be good for the game at all.

[Stan Rogers]

Well, its a topic that comes to light every now and again I think it could improve guild interaction, promote more new player guild admittance, lend to a guild a greater sense of kinship.
I'm sure somewhere, there are players who could and would exploit any holes that is usually present in any give or take situation as a sword cuts both ways usually.
In my opinion the bonuses gained would outweigh any holes that come with a plan. As I mentioned, a tweak of banking rules allowing joint account ownership should not be that hard to code.
Having that ability solves all the arguments of exploitation, milking, pushing and everything else if the depositor had to agree on their contribution being withdrawn.

Perhaps if some valid arguments were presented on how such a system could be exploited, please explain it in layman's terms to a dummy like me.

Sure. I am going to retire. I open joint account with someone and give them authorization to withdraw.

They withdraw entire amount and close account.

I am not against a guild bank at all. I am against it as it is proposed. Donation based could too easily be exploited.

A fee based structure that was equal for all members except maybe a grace period for new players would be fine. Combined with Shadows "Guild Tech Tree" suggestion or Wills "Guild booster" suggestion, then it gets in line with something like what other games have.

But to allow an unfettered donation type system just will not be good for the game at all.

Wrong !
You deposit 50 M and buddy deposits 50 M in SHM's bank. Buddy goes inactive, your total withdraw available would be 50M. Anything more and buddy has to sign off or it sits like the many other dead accounts in my bank that is untouchable but is there for when they return...if ever.
Lets take it a step further and lets say SHM is not the most honorable guy. What's stopping him from gathering a bunch of deposits then shutting down his bank trapping all the hard earned GC for his own use...well banking rules for 1 thing. He can loan it out but not with an unopened bank so it would be just a dickhead move to pull a stunt like that and then quit the game. the money won't do him any good but many would suffer the consequences.

I can go further and state bankers have been placed in a position of power and responsibility with many opportunities to exploit features so how come it very rarely happens ?

[sXs]

Yes.... so I am going inactive we both deposit 50 mill. I sign off on withdraw and then go inactive. Just arrange it before hand. Yes it is against the rules, but only if reported.