Extended Griefing is prohibited

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Re: Extended Griefing is prohibited

Postby DezNutz » Thu Sep 02, 2021 4:04 pm

Clockwork wrote:Player b casts on player a

Player a retaliates and casts on player b’s ships w levies

Player c fixes damaged ships for free

This is repeated

Is Player b Griefing?


The scenario you provided is very basic with little information, which allows for far too many possible ways to look at this for me to provide an answer that can't be scrutinized by what-ifs.

That being said, to quantify griefing one would have to look at the actions that correlate toward the suspected griefee which in the scenario provided would be Player A.

Per the provided scenario, Player A is only being targeted by Player B. Player A is retaliating against Player B. The actions of Player C which do not directly involve Player A are irrelevant to Player B's actions on Player A.

Thus as Player A is causing retaliatory damage to Player B's actions, this would be considered war.

The pseudo-transference of Player B's loss through Player C's attempted recompense of Player A's retaliation on Player B is irrelevant. Additionally, 1 to 1 casting of Call Leviathan to Expedition Journey are not a guarantee of equal trade. While level loss to level gain may be equal, the attribute loss and gain are not guaranteed of being the same. Thus even with Player C casting 1 Expedition Journey to every Call Leviathan cast by Player A, the loss incurred on Player B's ships could result in loss to Player B. There is also the chance that Player B gains from such activity, but such is all done by chance and thus is excluded from the factoring.

So based on the limited information in your scenario, I would say that NO, Player B is not griefing Player A, as Player A is retaliating.
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Re: Extended Griefing is prohibited

Postby Shadowood » Thu Sep 02, 2021 5:36 pm

I have now cast "Drums of War" voodoo on Clockwork for 11 days. I sure hope this is not griefing. This is helping his howkers get stronger!

9/2/2021 17:02 Drums of War Self Clockwork ***
9/2/2021 17:02 Drums of War Self Clockwork Blocked by Mindbar
8/31/2021 18:08 Drums of War Self Clockwork ***
8/31/2021 18:08 Drums of War Self Clockwork Blocked by Mindbar
8/30/2021 20:45 Spy Network Clockwork Self
8/30/2021 20:44 Drums of War Self Clockwork ***
8/30/2021 20:44 Drums of War Self Clockwork Blocked by Mindbar
8/30/2021 20:44 Drums of War Self Clockwork Blocked by Mindbar
8/27/2021 20:12 Trade Master Self Clockwork Blocked by Mindbar
8/27/2021 17:11 Drums of War Self Clockwork ***
8/27/2021 17:11 Drums of War Self Clockwork ***
8/26/2021 15:04 Drums of War Self Clockwork ***
8/25/2021 16:30 Rotten Food Clockwork Self No Cargo
8/25/2021 15:39 Drums of War Self Clockwork ***
8/25/2021 15:39 Drums of War Self Clockwork Blocked by Mindbar
8/24/2021 22:29 Drums of War Self Clockwork ***
8/24/2021 16:21 Drums of War Self Clockwork ***
8/24/2021 16:21 Drums of War Self Clockwork Blocked by Mindbar
8/24/2021 16:21 Drums of War Self Clockwork Blocked by Mindbar
8/24/2021 16:21 Drums of War Self Clockwork Blocked by Countercurse
8/24/2021 16:21 Drums of War Self Clockwork Blocked by Mindbar
8/23/2021 15:34 Drums of War Self Clockwork ***
8/23/2021 5:03 Confuse Clockwork Self
8/22/2021 22:19 Drums of War Self Clockwork ***
8/22/2021 22:19 Drums of War Self Clockwork Blocked by Mindbar
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Re: Extended Griefing is prohibited

Postby PFH » Thu Sep 02, 2021 5:50 pm

Shadowood wrote:I have now cast "Drums of War" voodoo on Clockwork for 11 days. I sure hope this is not griefing. This is helping his howkers get stronger!

9/2/2021 17:02 Drums of War Self Clockwork ***
9/2/2021 17:02 Drums of War Self Clockwork Blocked by Mindbar
8/31/2021 18:08 Drums of War Self Clockwork ***
8/31/2021 18:08 Drums of War Self Clockwork Blocked by Mindbar
8/30/2021 20:45 Spy Network Clockwork Self
8/30/2021 20:44 Drums of War Self Clockwork ***
8/30/2021 20:44 Drums of War Self Clockwork Blocked by Mindbar
8/30/2021 20:44 Drums of War Self Clockwork Blocked by Mindbar
8/27/2021 20:12 Trade Master Self Clockwork Blocked by Mindbar
8/27/2021 17:11 Drums of War Self Clockwork ***
8/27/2021 17:11 Drums of War Self Clockwork ***
8/26/2021 15:04 Drums of War Self Clockwork ***
8/25/2021 16:30 Rotten Food Clockwork Self No Cargo
8/25/2021 15:39 Drums of War Self Clockwork ***
8/25/2021 15:39 Drums of War Self Clockwork Blocked by Mindbar
8/24/2021 22:29 Drums of War Self Clockwork ***
8/24/2021 16:21 Drums of War Self Clockwork ***
8/24/2021 16:21 Drums of War Self Clockwork Blocked by Mindbar
8/24/2021 16:21 Drums of War Self Clockwork Blocked by Mindbar
8/24/2021 16:21 Drums of War Self Clockwork Blocked by Countercurse
8/24/2021 16:21 Drums of War Self Clockwork Blocked by Mindbar
8/23/2021 15:34 Drums of War Self Clockwork ***
8/23/2021 5:03 Confuse Clockwork Self
8/22/2021 22:19 Drums of War Self Clockwork ***
8/22/2021 22:19 Drums of War Self Clockwork Blocked by Mindbar


Literally every time you cast I’m imagining that meme :D
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Re: Extended Griefing is prohibited

Postby Mack » Thu Sep 02, 2021 7:29 pm

it is hard to put a definition on griefing in this game.. it is when one keeps casting voodoo on someone over and over with no retaliation for no reason
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Re: Extended Griefing is prohibited

Postby sXs » Thu Sep 02, 2021 7:42 pm

As far as I am concerneied....... there is no such thing as griefing if it is in response to being cast upon.


Player A cast Levies and sinks a SOTL of player B.....

Player B responds with 100 Levis.... FFJs for days.... Ambush everything...

No griefing. It was in response to being cast upon. Sometimes the only way to stop things from happening again is to return it 10-20 fold.

"Don't want none.... Dont start none....."

Also mo time frame for response. Player B is fully within his/her right to cast same day or a year from then.
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Re: Extended Griefing is prohibited

Postby Mack » Thu Sep 02, 2021 9:28 pm

i agree
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Re: Extended Griefing is prohibited

Postby Meliva » Thu Sep 02, 2021 11:46 pm

Apologies to taylor if I am in the wrong here. I was not aware that any casting back was being done- by the newbies that is. I know Mack was casting at you, was not aware of any castings done by Tom, or newbies, aside from spy reports and crystal balls. I believe I told them to use a confuse if they got one to limit your castings, but was never told by them if they took that advise. Based on what little I knew of the situation, it sounded like it could be griefing to me-so I linked this topic in the guild chat, and recommended to them that if they feel it is griefing after reading up on the rules, to report it.

I made sure to tell them that they need to be sure that they are correct before doing any reports so as to save CJ time and to avoid undue trouble. From what I knew of the situation, it sounded like griefing to me though I admit I did not know all the details., but in hindsight, really should have messaged you about it, but I guess I just wasn't thinking too clearly at the time. That and probably laziness. Again, I apologize for any wrongful accusations.
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Re: Extended Griefing is prohibited

Postby Mack » Fri Sep 03, 2021 1:03 am

and thats why its hard to define because i dont know if it should be ok to attack a bunch of relatively new players for days over a dispute with a well established vet. but then you have a jagged line if you start making calls like that
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Re: Extended Griefing is prohibited

Postby PFH » Fri Sep 03, 2021 4:20 am

Attacking players who aren’t involved is just childish in my opinion. Stick with the trouble maker, not the uninvolved. It’s like shooting a dudes mother because her son decided to steal a candy bar from a store.

:D
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Re: Extended Griefing is prohibited

Postby sXs » Fri Sep 03, 2021 4:36 am

Clockwork wrote:Attacking players who aren’t involved is just childish in my opinion. Stick with the trouble maker, not the uninvolved. It’s like shooting a dudes mother because her son decided to steal a candy bar from a store.

:D


hmmmmmm....... I disagree.

How is that different than hiring someone.... or a group of people to retaliate for you if you get hit.

player A casts on player B......

Player B hits player As an entire guild in retaliation......

if that is wrong then....

Player A casts on Player B....

Player B hires a group of players to retaliate on player A ......
...
in both cases, players that were not involved were brought into the conflict

If one is wrong then so is the other.
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