Guild Based Bonuses / Guild Cont. System / Tech Tree(Medium)

[Shadowood]

Whitcomb!

Welcome to the game mate. I have a few responses to a few points you made in your comment.

1. The Guild Based Bonuses (depending on the guild) would actually help and further the "physicality" that you speak of. If you are in a guild that focuses on "Battle" based tech, this will aid you. If other guilds choose to focus on "Trader" techs, this will also aid Pirates/Privateers as they will be able to raid those fat cats who will get fatter quicker.

2. Transporting resources to Embassy: First not all members in your guild will have their Hideouts in the same port. So a guild won't be transporting resources all to the same spot, forgive me if I misunderstood you on that point. In addition, with "Player Markets" now, you don't have to have trade ships for resources. Yes you will pay more for not transporting the good yourself, but a Player Based Market System will get a boost from a mechanic like this. I am pretty sure CJ would like this point as would those fat cat traders. But yes, you can transport yourself, so be on the look out for pirates or if you be a pirate yourself, look for good targets!

3. Embassy = Virtual Bank: First, Embassy like Banks will not be able to be plundered or attacked. This will be a place to store goods to level up. But the main thing about this is, once goods are deposited they cannot be taken back out. They are lost forever to the person that donated them. Which means they didn't make any money off it. They will be doing this to benefit the guild as a whole. So some decisions will need to be made on how much profit they want to lose to help the cause!

4. Guild vs. Nation: This is a tough one. Depending on play style it can be a conflict of interest. If you be a pirate or privateer, I would suggest you find Like Minded players, form a new guild/nation together and run it like your stole it. I know a few who have done this and have been successful. It does help to have all nation members in the same guild when under attack. You just need to decide how you want to play the game mate and make it work for you.

5. As far as "Attack-able Buildings", I really hope we get some sort of FORTS soon, so we may attack buildings in ports. Read up on that topic. Its a good one and hope it comes next in development.

[Whitcomb The Feared]

by phisicality i meant playing more on the map, but more on a specifi location. At the moment i see this game as we are gods and move our fleets like on a strategic map, from high we move our troops. like generals or like gods. I don't see the problematic of being a pirate and needing to move from A to B with the fear of being plundered.

1. point understood, i didn't criticize that

2. This is the point i meant by phisicality ! i mean that the embassy is a national building in the hands of the current king and it has to be located in a specific port. When you want to load resources at the embassy, you need to transport phisically by ship your goods to the embassy, and not loading via ethereum or internet and teleporting from each port the resources to a virtual embassy in the space.
We aren't gods we are pirates using ships to move our crews, people, gold bars, ...

And it is what i meant by phisicality about banks. Banks should be located in a specific port, and when money is lent, the banker needs to move the loan INSIDE ships (as cargo) to the location where the debtor is ! so the loan is plunderable as well as gold bars ! or it has no sense to create money which is not plunderable because it is in virtual banks and we can use the bank in this game as stock markets of 2019 where we can send via internet from London to NY to hong Kongm billion of dollars with a click. Here we play pirate life of 300-400 years ago, where everything was moved on the sea and was plunderable.

3. they aren't lost, it's just an investment which will be profitable it's an investment, not a loss.

4. we really need a correct definition: i don't understand why so many institutions like nations, guilds and maybe companies ... i don't see why so many different situations where once i have A as enemy, then A is friend, then A is guildmate ...

5. it's why i would like to see also Forts to defend ports but not defending only a port which generates taxes via citizens ! defending also buildings inside like banks (plunderable), embassies, and why not even plantations. It's that that i call phisicality.

[DezNutz]

Banks should be located in a specific port, and when money is lent, the banker needs to move the loan INSIDE ships (as cargo) to the location where the debtor is ! so the loan is plunderable

Except that's not how it worked back then.

The requester of the loan retrieved the loan money from the bank. The bank didn't take the money from the bank and deliver it to the debtor. Bankers only needed to move money if the bank branch didn't have sufficient money to cover paying out the loan.

[Shadowood]

We aren't gods we are pirates

I am a Pirate God. Haven't you heard?

[The Lamb]

So my thoughts on pirates:

1. I really think they should have a safe haven port that never can change hands but that can have a Pirate King based on stats just like nations.
2. I feel like they should have a different type of "banking" system where they can borrow GC and pay off with booty to replenish the port stocks. Booty can be GC, gold bars, iron, etc, and there should be a different price for fencing the goods.
3. I feel like there should be a special tech tree that is only available when you fly a pirate flag.
4. What if you were able to ransom ships you took back to the person you took them from in battle.
5. You should sell captured ships to the Pirate port warden for GC, but it should be higher than you get at shipwright.
6. Pirates get there own warehouse to store materials they plunder and or sell on black market to other pirates.
7. Pirates get their own "country discussion" so they can discuss things as we do with our country men and women.
8. Pirates can only build Brigantines and maybe a schooner? HMMMM?? Which has bonuses to attack and evade per tech tree upgrades well above normal for the ship type. Other ships must be captured.
9. Lastly, every successful plunder comes with a low chance of a chest of GC or a special type of good (gems, idols/relics, documents) that can be sold to black market for extra GC.

I figure this may loosly fit in the topic.

[PFH]

We aren't gods we are pirates

I am a Pirate God. Haven't you heard?

No. You only stole god’s man of war.

[Whitcomb The Feared]

Banks should be located in a specific port, and when money is lent, the banker needs to move the loan INSIDE ships (as cargo) to the location where the debtor is ! so the loan is plunderable

Except that's not how it worked back then.

The requester of the loan retrieved the loan money from the bank. The bank didn't take the money from the bank and deliver it to the debtor. Bankers only needed to move money if the bank branch didn't have sufficient money to cover paying out the loan.

But you understood my point the bank or the debtor must travel physically to take the money and to transfer it. And banks from America which wanted to bring profits to London (before American revolution), needed physically to move
Money on ships. What doesn’t happen here, cause here we send money from wallet to wallet via internet and it is not linked at all with pirates of the 17-18 century

[Sir Henry Morgan]

Banks should be located in a specific port, and when money is lent, the banker needs to move the loan INSIDE ships (as cargo) to the location where the debtor is ! so the loan is plunderable

Except that's not how it worked back then.

The requester of the loan retrieved the loan money from the bank. The bank didn't take the money from the bank and deliver it to the debtor. Bankers only needed to move money if the bank branch didn't have sufficient money to cover paying out the loan.

But you understood my point the bank or the debtor must travel physically to take the money and to transfer it. And banks from America which wanted to bring profits to London (before American revolution), needed physically to move
Money on ships. What doesn’t happen here, cause here we send money from wallet to wallet via internet and it is not linked at all with pirates of the 17-18 century

Interesting! This may be something to be addressed with flagship techs - transport could be made via GC or gold bars....but it opens an entire new perspective to game dynamics:

For instance, we also have the issue of skirmish and plunder bounties - they currently come from one's personal treasury rather than each individual fleet - perhaps the head of each fleet (1st ship of each fleet) carries funding for such contingencies....

One must have funds in port to build a warehouse, so a ship with said funds must move GC/GB to port to purchase the warehouse. What about goods traded?

Trade ships would need to bear GC/bars to buy/sell and then actually unload profits into a bank or bury it in port location. The same with swag captured in plunder or skirmish - all is aboard ships until swag is buried or deposited somewhere.

This definitely revamps the entire economic structure of PG - and will change the entire dynamic of ships, trade and battle...much like casting voodoo from ships. It will definitely open an entire new can of worms!

[Most Lee Harmless]

Except there existed money transfer systems long before the golden age of piracy. The Knights Templars, for example, ran a banking system which did not rely upon the movement of coin. The Rothchilds built their banking fortune on letters of credit which negated the need to move large lumps of gold around. In one notable case one of the Austrian branch of Rothschilds travelled disguised as a women across French held Europe to deliver the necessary Letter of Credit which released local funds in Portugal to sustain the British Army fighting there. In the Middle East and across to India, in China, Thailand and South America, informal banking systems exist to this day that operate without actually moving coin. Indeed, Western Union is based on that same principal of operation.

Wikipedia have a good article on such 'Informal Value Transfer Systems' : some have been traced back to 4000 years ago. Or google 'hawala' : 'fei ch'ien' or 'ploe kuan' for specific geographic types.

But in the ceaseless search for the 'realism' which always seems to give pirates a bigger slice of plunder lets not forget the other aspect of such 'realism' : back then if a pirate lost the battle they got hung. So.. lose a skirmish and the pirates account gets deleted due to such a hanging... nah... too much realism, methinks..

[Whitcomb The Feared]

in both cases i understand your point, but you are unfortunately wrong

in monetary economics there is a distinction between money and a letter of credit. Even in your examples, people have debts and they have no money. You still need real coins to make the economic system working, you can't work on debts because it becomes only a system of barter.

even with the rotschilds, they maybe sent letters of credits but they always received their sums back in gold and/or valuable resources ! they never received back a piece of paper with written the amount they made their fortune with real values, not with letter of credits. so they maybe sent letters of credit to the english army in portugal with written "you have now X dollars on your bank account" but when the british army spent this money they maybe gave the piece of paper with written X, then the supplier still had to go to Austria or the closest rotschilds bank to receive phisically his sum of real money.
But here when we play, we have sums of real money teleported from port to port and i think it is sad.


About pirates being hung, yes and no. Here we play more the role of the privateer, we plunder other ships in the name of our nation. So we could be hung by our enemies in case of defeat. Yeah we could introduce it, not the hung of the account's owner but the death of the captain and all the crew could be a possibility.