Fishing Ship - Dogger (Medium)

[Sir Henry Morgan]

I don't know, 3 days is good. If market is better in another port after the update, fishing fleets will be moved...

[Sir Henry Morgan]

Another thought - fishing fleets should be able to sell in food ports for the same rates as plantationd - in this case, a permission paid with credits would be fair to plantation owners....(that may be a tech upgrade, too!)

[ChaIbaud]

i dont really see how the lack of cannons really counteracts the amount of profits to be had off of those fleets unless i didnt read something the right way they still just go out of port and come back when they catch some fish so they arent accruing danger in the same way a fleet that would need cannons would, in which case they could only be skirmished or attacked and chances are each skirmish is going to give less than that one fleet would make in a day, so if you have more than 3 it will always be profitable for the fishing fleets. of course they can still get attacked with fugitives but who really does that anymore *cough* juice *cough*

[Meliva]

you could still hit them with hostile natives, as they do need to return to port to sell the goods unless I am misremembering how fishing works. And with no cannons, a pirate could literally just hit each fleet with a single cutter and win each battle without even needing to repair between hits. With trade ships a trader can put up some protection on them to make such raids harder and less frequent.

I do think that care needs to be taken to make sure fishing doesn't overshadow trade completely, but it does need to be boosted.

[ChaIbaud]

i just figured fishing was always supposed to be a weak choice because it presents little danger. if we are buffing underpowered game mechanics i could name a few others to ramp up

[Sir Henry Morgan]

No Cannon would mean a brand new pirate with a level 1 howker with 15 crew and one Cannon can take out a fishing fleet....

He just has to find them.

You talk about a return on investment - the cost of a howker for 40-50 naval battle wins? One lost defending battle, lost howker and normal Plunder rewards....

The idea is to create a risk to running fishing fleet. Right now, trade ships are used, and have a chance to defend - and will require at least a leveled up sloop or better. I have seen leveled up trade ships ysed in plundering other trade ships. I've seen warships carry cargo. Both have natural restrictions due to their class.

The fishing vessel is a ship with one purpose - fishing, and it ain't nothing's fast or fancy. It's perk is it can create profits without being easily seen - so it needs some drawbacks to level it's viability compared to other ships.

I like the idea of only a single level - fleet loses, it sinks. (If not captured). No Cannon. No attributes. No traits. 25-50% resale value to shipwright.

I would also consider that doggers cannot be sold on the market - they can only be sold to the shipwright. This makes it a bit more difficult to build fishing fleets fast with credits.

You either build a dogger, capture it in battle or commandeer it (for whatever that's worth.) Perhaps a tech can be developed to where any other ship can be converted to a dogger, or perhaps that's how you build one in the first place - perhaps large Fluyt or higher.

Permissions paid to fish a port will keep them off the gossip page, fail to pay permission and it will be there. While ship techs could be used to determine the number of fisherman officers, I think the current system can be used, but instead of starting a new category, add it to merchant. When one goes to hire that level, he chises whether he wants to hire a merchant or a fisherman.

I see a few new curses in the works - here's one:

Drunken Sailor
UnCommon
10 Turns
75% piercing

Victim's fleets get into their rum rations, and get more than a snoot full. Crews start forgetting to unload cargo. All routes run for 10 hours without unloading any cargo.

Trade fleets will just bounce between ports for no profit or warehouse stocking. Fishing fleets, however, will be on the Plunder screen in under an hour as they bounce in and out of port trying to unload, but don't....

...at least that's the idea.

Fishing does need an adjustment.

[ChaIbaud]

i agree it could use an adjustment just trying to prod the embers to get the discussion going in a new way. also i like the idea of loss meaning sunk if not captured

[Kangaroo]

I'm a big fan of the idea and 90% of the pregressive refiinements suggested, I do though think 3 days is ridiculously short.
It's currently 90 days for plants and it often takes a day or two to get an extension, 30 at a minimum would also mean higher fees paid.

[Dmanwuzhere]

lol fishing seems to be getting as ineffective as plantations the more its talked about there is no way i would pay credits to fish unless every trade route of any type was being subjected to a business tax of the same type
fishing has never been better than trading and never should be but taxes on fish while thousands of ships flow through ports daily untaxed seems a bit tilted

[DezNutz]

Well what if we make that to own more than 5 fishers you need to research tech in academy that way we get gold coins and gold bars sinker aswell.

Coming back to this.

I'm hesitant to limit the number of doggers or fishing fleets one can have.

The dogger isn't going to replace all fishing fleets. Players will still be able to use the other ships to fish. So limiting fishing fleets is a non-starter.

I'm on the fence with limiting the number of doggers one can possess. There is no limitation to the number of ship one can own, why limit the dogger.

Tech is a limited GB sink. Once the tech is maxed, it no longer sinks GB. Fishing tech is definitely an option that should be looked into, but should not be a limiter.

I think a boost to fishing will help move us more towards 100% player based resource production, and it also gives more options down the road for resource sinks, so we shouldn't limit fishing.

fishing has never been better than trading and never should be but taxes on fish while thousands of ships flow through ports daily untaxed seems a bit tilted

I agree with dman. I see no reason to tax fishing fleets for port entry when regular fleets aren't taxed for port entry.



Points that I think should be added to the Dogger:

- Gold Bar Cost for Building. (20 Bars)

- 100% Sink Chance If Plundered (Ship Count based Sink Chance is ignored)

- Can't be sold on the Market. Can only be sold back to shipwright.

- Level 1 Ship Only (No Attributes for Allocation)

- Does not receive Ship Traits