PGPromo Team - Special Edition Rebuttal
Posted: Sat Jul 18, 2020 4:49 pmIn the interest of providing equal time and representation to all parties involved in a given issue or event, PGPromo Team has reached out to the various persons taking exception to our previous post "Special Edition", written by El Draque. This post dealt with the recent Fantasy Draft Competition. El Draque expressed his point of view concerning the somewhat dramatic and upsetting events that occurred during the Draft.
One of the other Captains involved, Feniks, has stepped up with this Rebuttal.
So batten down your hatches you swabs. This be the unvarnished version.
And now, without any further ado, in his own words, here is Fenik's Rebuttal:
I was also excited about the Fantasy Draft. Out of all the Achievements I have received, the ones that mean the most to me are
Fantasy Draft Fantasy Draft II Youngest Avonmoran Pick
Fantasy Draft Fantasy Draft II Draft Selection
Top Helper 1 award
The reason these are the most important to me is because they are voted on by the player base. The first draft I was Fantasy Draft II. I had only been in game for a few months. I was hoping to be someone’s rookie pick, but I know there were only 5 rookies selected so I was not expecting it. Not only was I selected, but I was selected in the 9th round, 2 before the rookie picks. It is one of the main reasons I stuck with the game as long as I have.
So now to respond with facts instead of telling a story. Direct response to each point made in the work of fantasy.
1. Acts of God.
Yes, one of the captains had a last-minute emergency. Here was the issue. Why not move it back a day or two? No one would have complained. Not only that, a few hours later, the captain that had the emergency returned. We could have made accommodations for him and kept the integrity of the draft. When the draft coordinators were asked why they didn’t push the draft back, the response was if it didn’t happen when scheduled it wouldn’t happen at all? When asked why that was the case, there was no response. Still to this day, no response has been given.
2. Acts of Ego
The nastiness did not start because one team or another was in the lead, it started because there was proof the team leading was buying or attempting to buy votes. That was made clear in the forums with documented proof. The reason for the nastiness was because the captain of the team in the lead would not simply acknowledge that it was happening, nor admit it may be playing a role in the voting…… talk about ego…
As far as the witty banter? It was in the form of direct insults to some of the most storied and accomplished players in the game. Claiming their history, accomplishments, and achievements in game meant nothing. That was another reason there was the nastiness. You reap what you sow.
3. Acts of Piracy
Should run for political office with this claim. It was not an act of piracy it was at worst a direct violation of the rules, at best, the most dishonorable action one could take. I am g lad that at least now, a month later, you acknowledge it happened. It was not acknowledged by the cheating teams captain at the time. It wasn’t denounced “if it happened” until there were only a few hours left in the voting. Even when the cheater admitted it publicly in the forums, no acknowledgement was made by the cheaters team captain.
As far as the voting goes, I admitted at the time, that my actions in the forum was costing my team votes and I was going to pay my team first place prize money out of my own treasury no matter how the voting turned out, which I did. While I admitted my action may have cost my team votes, the captain of the cheaters team would not acknowledge that the actions may have gained his own team votes. Still to this day that has not been acknowledged...
4. Acts of Sour Grapes
There were no sour grapes. There were facts. Someone cheated, that person admitted publicly that they cheated. The fact that he admitted it showed more honor than his team captain ever showed by not even acknowledging it happened, admitting to cheating was more honorable than insulting other teams claiming their achievements in game meant nothing.
As far as public support, I received support across the board as well, even from people on the cheaters team. I also had support from the other 2 team captains. They all agreed with me.
5. Position of Neutrality
I too contacted admins. They stated the same thing to me. “ This admin said first off, the developers don’t get involved in these and second, since it had never been an issue before, it can’t be now.” I then pointed out the fact that in a past scenario, accounts were banned and removed for draft. I sent link to the exact draft forum and conversations had at the time. That same admin admitted he had forgotten about it. Admin DID get involved in the past, admin DID take action in the past.
As far as achievements. The statement in this work of fiction is completely false. Neither I nor the other two team captains advocated for achievements not being awarded. I, and the other two captains only suggested that the WINNING Team portion be dropped. All players selected would still get their achievement and all captains would get theirs as well. I sent a message to CJ that I did not want any achievement given to me associated with this draft and I believe at least one other captain did as well.
Now as far as the rules violation comment. That was not concocted or made up.
The rules violations cited came right from the game rules, links and quotes were provided. Using someone elses account to gain financially in game is a violation. Taking advantage of other players to gain an advantage in game financially is against the rules.
Now some claimed it was a forum game so not subject to these rules. Two points about this.
#1 the prizes were in game prizes in the form of coin, credits and in game achievements, thus making them subject to the rules. Read the “Examples” section of the milking pushing rule.
#2 Even if it were a forum only game, the admitted cheater is a forum Global Moderator. He was at the time and is still one today. That makes the whole thing far far worse. At a minimum, he should have been removed from moderator permissions immediately. Others have had their moderator privileges removed for far less. In some instances their moderator privileges were removed because they hurt someones feelings.
All the above are facts, not works of fiction, not opinion, not an OP-ED.
Now this section is my opinion. As far as calling out the PR team who was running the draft, I stated this in a direct message to them. They disappeared during all of this. No comments no posts, nothing. In fact, someone else had to pick up the duties of posting the picks in the comment forum for the draft because THE PEOPLE RUNNING THE DRAFT SIMPLY DISAPPEARED. That is why they got called out and criticized. Also they never answered inquiries during and after the draft. They made statements without explanation.
I have loved the fantasy draft from day one. I was upset for several reasons.
#1 Cheating occurred, it was admitted by the person who did it. Although this pissed me off, he did the honorable thing and admitted it, and I acknowledged to him in the forums that his admission was honorable and thanked him.
#2 Absolutely no repercussions taken. Forom the examples section of the rules…..
-If you gained 5millions from the total case,you will have 10 millions removed.
-If you gained a few credits or cards through an inside deal, since we do not give credit penalties, we will count it as a double offense as shown below.
Extra penalties:
1st offense: 5 Ambush cards to best fleet, 3 FoJ and up to 5 millions from buried treasure.
2nd offense: 10 Ambush cards to best fleet, 3 FoJ and up to 10 millions from buried treasure.
3rd offense: All offensive enchantments, multiple (5 to 50) Booty Master, Official List of Demands, Assasin, Time Spiral, Call Leviathan, Sabotage cards. Up to 50 Ambush cards to best fleet and up to 100 Millions from buried treasure.
4rth Offense: Permanent ban”
The only thing I was asking was that no “Winning Team” achievements be awarded.
#3 The least honorable person in all of this was the captain of the winning team. Would not admit it happened even after the person admitted it in forums. Would not admit it may have gained his team votes. Insulted several players on other teams saying their accomplishments were in the past and basically claiming they were insignificant.(not my words, comments I received from those who were insulted.”
#4 Writing an “OP-ED” portraying ones own actions as honorable and still denigrating others in the process, even a month later. Trying to rewrite the history of this draft with outright lies and false claims.
I have the emails and messages to back up everything I said in the first section. Every point is fact, not something I made up in my own mind to make myself look good and others look bad….. unlike some. I admitted my actions were wrong…… unlike some. The person that cheated admitted their action were wrong…. Unlike some.
One of the other Captains involved, Feniks, has stepped up with this Rebuttal.
So batten down your hatches you swabs. This be the unvarnished version.
And now, without any further ado, in his own words, here is Fenik's Rebuttal:
I was also excited about the Fantasy Draft. Out of all the Achievements I have received, the ones that mean the most to me are
Fantasy Draft Fantasy Draft II Youngest Avonmoran Pick
Fantasy Draft Fantasy Draft II Draft Selection
Top Helper 1 award
The reason these are the most important to me is because they are voted on by the player base. The first draft I was Fantasy Draft II. I had only been in game for a few months. I was hoping to be someone’s rookie pick, but I know there were only 5 rookies selected so I was not expecting it. Not only was I selected, but I was selected in the 9th round, 2 before the rookie picks. It is one of the main reasons I stuck with the game as long as I have.
So now to respond with facts instead of telling a story. Direct response to each point made in the work of fantasy.
1. Acts of God.
Yes, one of the captains had a last-minute emergency. Here was the issue. Why not move it back a day or two? No one would have complained. Not only that, a few hours later, the captain that had the emergency returned. We could have made accommodations for him and kept the integrity of the draft. When the draft coordinators were asked why they didn’t push the draft back, the response was if it didn’t happen when scheduled it wouldn’t happen at all? When asked why that was the case, there was no response. Still to this day, no response has been given.
2. Acts of Ego
The nastiness did not start because one team or another was in the lead, it started because there was proof the team leading was buying or attempting to buy votes. That was made clear in the forums with documented proof. The reason for the nastiness was because the captain of the team in the lead would not simply acknowledge that it was happening, nor admit it may be playing a role in the voting…… talk about ego…
As far as the witty banter? It was in the form of direct insults to some of the most storied and accomplished players in the game. Claiming their history, accomplishments, and achievements in game meant nothing. That was another reason there was the nastiness. You reap what you sow.
3. Acts of Piracy
Should run for political office with this claim. It was not an act of piracy it was at worst a direct violation of the rules, at best, the most dishonorable action one could take. I am g lad that at least now, a month later, you acknowledge it happened. It was not acknowledged by the cheating teams captain at the time. It wasn’t denounced “if it happened” until there were only a few hours left in the voting. Even when the cheater admitted it publicly in the forums, no acknowledgement was made by the cheaters team captain.
As far as the voting goes, I admitted at the time, that my actions in the forum was costing my team votes and I was going to pay my team first place prize money out of my own treasury no matter how the voting turned out, which I did. While I admitted my action may have cost my team votes, the captain of the cheaters team would not acknowledge that the actions may have gained his own team votes. Still to this day that has not been acknowledged...
4. Acts of Sour Grapes
There were no sour grapes. There were facts. Someone cheated, that person admitted publicly that they cheated. The fact that he admitted it showed more honor than his team captain ever showed by not even acknowledging it happened, admitting to cheating was more honorable than insulting other teams claiming their achievements in game meant nothing.
As far as public support, I received support across the board as well, even from people on the cheaters team. I also had support from the other 2 team captains. They all agreed with me.
5. Position of Neutrality
I too contacted admins. They stated the same thing to me. “ This admin said first off, the developers don’t get involved in these and second, since it had never been an issue before, it can’t be now.” I then pointed out the fact that in a past scenario, accounts were banned and removed for draft. I sent link to the exact draft forum and conversations had at the time. That same admin admitted he had forgotten about it. Admin DID get involved in the past, admin DID take action in the past.
As far as achievements. The statement in this work of fiction is completely false. Neither I nor the other two team captains advocated for achievements not being awarded. I, and the other two captains only suggested that the WINNING Team portion be dropped. All players selected would still get their achievement and all captains would get theirs as well. I sent a message to CJ that I did not want any achievement given to me associated with this draft and I believe at least one other captain did as well.
Now as far as the rules violation comment. That was not concocted or made up.
The rules violations cited came right from the game rules, links and quotes were provided. Using someone elses account to gain financially in game is a violation. Taking advantage of other players to gain an advantage in game financially is against the rules.
Now some claimed it was a forum game so not subject to these rules. Two points about this.
#1 the prizes were in game prizes in the form of coin, credits and in game achievements, thus making them subject to the rules. Read the “Examples” section of the milking pushing rule.
#2 Even if it were a forum only game, the admitted cheater is a forum Global Moderator. He was at the time and is still one today. That makes the whole thing far far worse. At a minimum, he should have been removed from moderator permissions immediately. Others have had their moderator privileges removed for far less. In some instances their moderator privileges were removed because they hurt someones feelings.
All the above are facts, not works of fiction, not opinion, not an OP-ED.
Now this section is my opinion. As far as calling out the PR team who was running the draft, I stated this in a direct message to them. They disappeared during all of this. No comments no posts, nothing. In fact, someone else had to pick up the duties of posting the picks in the comment forum for the draft because THE PEOPLE RUNNING THE DRAFT SIMPLY DISAPPEARED. That is why they got called out and criticized. Also they never answered inquiries during and after the draft. They made statements without explanation.
I have loved the fantasy draft from day one. I was upset for several reasons.
#1 Cheating occurred, it was admitted by the person who did it. Although this pissed me off, he did the honorable thing and admitted it, and I acknowledged to him in the forums that his admission was honorable and thanked him.
#2 Absolutely no repercussions taken. Forom the examples section of the rules…..
-If you gained 5millions from the total case,you will have 10 millions removed.
-If you gained a few credits or cards through an inside deal, since we do not give credit penalties, we will count it as a double offense as shown below.
Extra penalties:
1st offense: 5 Ambush cards to best fleet, 3 FoJ and up to 5 millions from buried treasure.
2nd offense: 10 Ambush cards to best fleet, 3 FoJ and up to 10 millions from buried treasure.
3rd offense: All offensive enchantments, multiple (5 to 50) Booty Master, Official List of Demands, Assasin, Time Spiral, Call Leviathan, Sabotage cards. Up to 50 Ambush cards to best fleet and up to 100 Millions from buried treasure.
4rth Offense: Permanent ban”
The only thing I was asking was that no “Winning Team” achievements be awarded.
#3 The least honorable person in all of this was the captain of the winning team. Would not admit it happened even after the person admitted it in forums. Would not admit it may have gained his team votes. Insulted several players on other teams saying their accomplishments were in the past and basically claiming they were insignificant.(not my words, comments I received from those who were insulted.”
#4 Writing an “OP-ED” portraying ones own actions as honorable and still denigrating others in the process, even a month later. Trying to rewrite the history of this draft with outright lies and false claims.
I have the emails and messages to back up everything I said in the first section. Every point is fact, not something I made up in my own mind to make myself look good and others look bad….. unlike some. I admitted my actions were wrong…… unlike some. The person that cheated admitted their action were wrong…. Unlike some.
