Avonmora First Peace Summit- Derailed and rejected. Debate

[DezNutz]

You equate hatred with common sense. We (our country) do not hate Israel (although after the Western peace actions in the former Yugoslavia we entered a group of third countries of the world, or it is better to say, we have become one of your satellites and have many "consultants"). Yet, common sense is common sense.
Do you think that almost all European politicians represent a bunch of 3rd world dictators? Or Asians, South Americans ...?

When you leave your home, do you lock your door. I'm sure you don't go running around the neighborhood, locking everyone else's door while leaving yours wide open.

Believe me or not, we never had to lock our door when running the neighborhood, in time I lived in YU. This custom came with our ''political awareness'' or so called democracy... not before...

And... as usual, we endangered the main topic...

LOL.

You are equating most to meaning all.

Yeah common sense, except that common sense seemed to ignore UN Resolution 181. And then there was Arab-Israeli War of 1948, the 6 Day war in 1967, then the Yum Kippur War in 1973, UN Resolution 350 in 1974, and the Camp David Accords in 1978. But let's forget about those when we speak about common sense.

[sXs]

You equate hatred with common sense. We (our country) do not hate Israel (although after the Western peace actions in the former Yugoslavia we entered a group of third countries of the world, or it is better to say, we have become one of your satellites and have many "consultants"). Yet, common sense is common sense.
Do you think that almost all European politicians represent a bunch of 3rd world dictators? Or Asians, South Americans ...?

When you leave your home, do you lock your door. I'm sure you don't go running around the neighborhood, locking everyone else's door while leaving yours wide open.

Believe me or not, we never had to lock our door when running the neighborhood, in time I lived in YU. This custom came with our ''political awareness'' or so called democracy... not before...

And... as usual, we endangered the main topic...

LOL.

You are equating most to meaning all.

Yeah common sense, except that common sense seemed to ignore UN Resolution 181. And then there was Arab-Israeli War of 1948, the 6 Day war in 1967, then the Yum Kippur War in 1973, UN Resolution 350 in 1974, and the Camp David Accords in 1978. But let's forget about those when we speak about common sense.

I agree with your train of thinking Dez. One comment though. The genesis of a Jewish "state" was not UN Resolution 181, It was the Balfour agreement of 1944 I believe. 181 simply laid the groundwork for governance until Israel could be self sustaining. But you are correct in pointing out that many of the anti Israel votes, again many, not all, come from countries the voted for and signed 181. At that time Gaza, the west bank and much more of the region, was not claimed by any nation. It was basically ignored other than Jerusalem. The modern "Palestine" did not exist before 1948.

The whole topic and area of history is very interesting.

[sXs]

[Noffin]

[PhoenixKnight]

LOL.

You are equating most to meaning all.

Yeah common sense, except that common sense seemed to ignore UN Resolution 181. And then there was Arab-Israeli War of 1948, the 6 Day war in 1967, then the Yum Kippur War in 1973, UN Resolution 350 in 1974, and the Camp David Accords in 1978. But let's forget about those when we speak about common sense.

I agree with your train of thinking Dez. One comment though. The genesis of a Jewish "state" was not UN Resolution 181, It was the Balfour agreement of 1944 I believe. 181 simply laid the groundwork for governance until Israel could be self sustaining. But you are correct in pointing out that many of the anti Israel votes, again many, not all, come from countries the voted for and signed 181. At that time Gaza, the west bank and much more of the region, was not claimed by any nation. It was basically ignored other than Jerusalem. The modern "Palestine" did not exist before 1948.

The whole topic and area of history is very interesting.[/quote]
Correction. Balfour promise was in 1918.
Israel declared independence much like Texas can declare independence from the IS. Europe and US intervened to make Israel establishment in Palestine successful on occupied land.

From that point Israel expands in Palestine leaving a blood trail of massacre and human rights violations
1967 Israel occupies land in 4 new countries.
1973 the occupied land of 1967 are reclaimed via war in part and negotiated for the next few years.
From then on Israel focuses on occupying all Palestine continuing illegitimate practices with USA vectoring any measure the UN tries to take.
2017 USA recognizes Jerusalem as the captital of Israel even though Israel had no presence in Israel till 1967.

So the premise is Israel exists only on occupied Palestine land and has violated tons of laws and committed tons of war crimes since its establishment

[sXs]

Correct. Sorry I got my dates mixed. I am getting old and the things learned in a history class are slowly fading.

Although I disagree with your "occupied land" interpretation. 181 established the initial borders of the Jewish state. Yes the US intervened to help protect the newly formed Jewish state, along with other nations.

Palestine was under British control during that time. The British Mandate ended in 1948 I believe.

Listen the creation of Israel was legal under the law of the time. As a recognized state, they are allowed to defend themselves. Yes there is still contention, but until other nations recognize their right to exist, there will never be peace. Israel has spilled blood, but so have the surrounding nations and the Palestinians. You and i can argue what is right or wrong, and debate the history, but none of that will resolve the issue.

[DezNutz]

History says otherwise. The land of Israel has existed for thousands of years. That is documented in both the Bible and the Koran. It was also documented as such in Roman History. When occupied under the Romans, they didn't call it the land of the Palestinians.

Plus what Feniks just said.

[PhoenixKnight]

Let’s give back USA to native Americans, kick out the Saxon’s from UK, and give France back to the Gaule

[Jack Teach]

Let’s give back USA to native Americans, kick out the Saxon’s from UK, and give France back to the Gaule

No thanks

[sXs]

Let’s give back USA to native Americans, kick out the Saxon’s from UK, and give France back to the Gaule

By that argument we all head back to Africa then. The supposed "cradle of life".

70 years now Israel has been recognized. How long before the rest of the region recognizes their right as a sovereign nation just like all the other nations you just listed.

Israel is not going away. Much more good would come if the nations in the region recognized them than if they continue on the current path. 70 years of fighting now, yet they are still there.