Biden 2020

[The Lamb]

LMAO!

That poster does make sense, alot of people dont know that The Nazi's were the The National Socialist German Workers' Party. Its a misinterpretation (obviously accidental of course ) that since the nazi's were fighting communists, and communists are far left that the nazi's were far right, its actually the opposite, the Nazi's were National Socialists which arose out of attempts to create a nationalist redefinition of socialism centered more closely to Mussolini's fascism, as an alternative to both Marxists (left) and capitalism (right).

They were a far left group trying to redefine socialism

Even Mussolini started out a socialist but repudiated socialism in disgust and in the,1920s he founded political fascism which synthesized the working-class edge of socialism with militant nationalism but opposed both capitalism and socialism. This would indicate that fascism in not right or left but more of a third option, maybe just a d bag. lol Yes i know there are some who try and say fascism is far right yet again... noppers.

Turns out all you need to do, gather like minded people who are worried about something, make enemies of those who "oppressed your people" or "are the reason for our troubles", start protests, riots and intimidate anyone who doesnt believe what you do, for the Nazi's it was the brown shirts, for Mussolini the black shirts, have these groups start physically attacking your political opponents or other forms of violence, tear down the existing fabric of society with fear, tell people you can fix everything with an ideology and poof pow new nut job republic.

Good times.

wouldn't capitalism be centre? Since democracy is centre and it usually goes with capitalism

I found a decent quote: "The economic (left–right) axis measures one's opinion of how the economy should be run: "left" is defined as the desire for the economy to be run by a cooperative collective agency (which can mean the state, but can also mean a network of communes) while "right" is defined as the desire for the economy to be left to the devices of competing individuals and organizations." Soooooo, left is socialism/comunism and right is capitalism.

Democracy is not center, right or left, we have democracy but elections in North Korea are held every four-to-five years for the Supreme People's Assembly (SPA), the country's national legislature, and every four years for Local People's Assemblies. All seats are won by the Democratic Front for the Reunification of the Fatherland.

[Leo]

Yeah, that compass stuff can be confusing. It's important not to think of it linearly left-right, because it's more like a graph: left(communism)-right(neo-liberalism) horizontally and authoritarian-libertarian vertically. To find where you lie on this graph a handy tool is this test: https://www.politicalcompass.org/test

It isn't 100% accurate and is a little outdated, but it definitely gets pretty darn close.
To cover what El Draque said, here is where some well known people lie on the graph:
When I took the test, here is where I am:


Of course this is just an idea. Another cool test that helps figure out where you stand politically: https://www.isidewith.com/elections/202 ... ntial-quiz

This actually tells you how much you agree with each candidate which was pretty darn helpful to me when deciding who I agreed with. It surprised me that I agreed 97% with Julian Castro who I had never payed attention to before. After that I started listening more closely to what he said and I started to realize that I liked him. Of course the DNC had to come shove their big moderate ass in the middle of things and nominate Creepy Uncle Joe. I guess now it's between picking the worse of two evils. There is always the 3rd party candidates but I learned from the 2016 election that they often can't be trusted. I think America is almost definitely screwed either way. I just hope Joe picks a good VP

[The Lamb]

Here is mine. Nice post, good to see, and funny enough i am damn near exactly were i thought i would be and thats why im an independent and believe the truth is never on the right or the left, it resides in the middle

The far left and far right are just as bad as each other in ideas. Remember, most Americans are moderate dems, moderate repubs and independents, and there is a reason for that

[William one eye]

Unfortunately tests that pair you with particular candidates are matching you with their political platforms not their actual actions once they have your vote.

It matched me 80% with Trump

And 70% with Jo Jorgensen

I show left because of my social beliefs but i tend to vote right
Because i detest increasing the size of the government and their abilty to oversight.

[Lachlan]

LMAO!

That poster does make sense, alot of people dont know that The Nazi's were the The National Socialist German Workers' Party. Its a misinterpretation (obviously accidental of course ) that since the nazi's were fighting communists, and communists are far left that the nazi's were far right, its actually the opposite, the Nazi's were National Socialists which arose out of attempts to create a nationalist redefinition of socialism centered more closely to Mussolini's fascism, as an alternative to both Marxists (left) and capitalism (right).

They were a far left group trying to redefine socialism

Even Mussolini started out a socialist but repudiated socialism in disgust and in the,1920s he founded political fascism which synthesized the working-class edge of socialism with militant nationalism but opposed both capitalism and socialism. This would indicate that fascism in not right or left but more of a third option, maybe just a d bag. lol Yes i know there are some who try and say fascism is far right yet again... noppers.

Turns out all you need to do, gather like minded people who are worried about something, make enemies of those who "oppressed your people" or "are the reason for our troubles", start protests, riots and intimidate anyone who doesnt believe what you do, for the Nazi's it was the brown shirts, for Mussolini the black shirts, have these groups start physically attacking your political opponents or other forms of violence, tear down the existing fabric of society with fear, tell people you can fix everything with an ideology and poof pow new nut job republic.

Good times.

wouldn't capitalism be centre? Since democracy is centre and it usually goes with capitalism

I found a decent quote: "The economic (left–right) axis measures one's opinion of how the economy should be run: "left" is defined as the desire for the economy to be run by a cooperative collective agency (which can mean the state, but can also mean a network of communes) while "right" is defined as the desire for the economy to be left to the devices of competing individuals and organizations." Soooooo, left is socialism/comunism and right is capitalism.

Democracy is not center, right or left, we have democracy but elections in North Korea are held every four-to-five years for the Supreme People's Assembly (SPA), the country's national legislature, and every four years for Local People's Assemblies. All seats are won by the Democratic Front for the Reunification of the Fatherland.

[DezNutz]

That political compass graph is bullshit to begin with. It's based on the bullshit concept communism is on the far left and fascism is to the far right.

The political spectrum moves from full government control (Left) to no government(Right).


This is a more realistic representation of the political spectrum. With the USA being around the 30-40% mark.

[Meliva]

I do agree with Dez that I don't really agree with the test myself. Some of the questions are a bit vague, and I don't like how every choice is either agree or disagree. Some of the questions I was indifferent to or had some exceptions. Regardless, I admit I do think I am fairly in the center.

Edit- on a side note, looks like me and Draque are more or less neighbors on the chart

[Leo]

That political compass graph is bullshit to begin with. It's based on the bullshit concept communism is on the far left and fascism is to the far right.

The political spectrum moves from full government control (Left) to no government(Right).


This is a more realistic representation of the political spectrum. With the USA being around the 30-40% mark.

Hmm, not sure what you're going for with that one. It's not just left-right. If so then theoretically I would agree with someone who was just as economically progressive as I am, even if they had completely different social beliefs. It's okay to agree with me. It's not a sin. You don't have to argue with me about literally everything just because we don't agree on a lot of political topics. Also "It's based on the bullshit concept communism is on the far left and fascism is to the far right" isn't correct. Fascism is actually the top, not the right. Communism is the left, but the more left you go, the closer you get. I don't think that there is anything fascist about the right. I actually know some people who are pretty far left yet also pretty far to the top. It's possible to be left and fascist. It's not very likely that you will meet a republican who is pro-communism, however. People are taught in school that communism is evil and are shown examples of why. And for the most part I wouldn't want it either. I would lean towards socialism because it is private-business-oriented. But usually when socialism and communism has gone wrong it's because it got mixed with authoritarianism. I believe that both communism and socialism could work if it was based on libertarian values and the entire thing was set up correctly. Obviously it would be complicated, but i think it could be done. As for whether or not the US should go communist, I don't think that's a good idea. People here don't cooperate very well, and many are much too proud of the elitist capitalist setup that the country currently has to want to change. Fine by me, I'll just move to Canada or Sweden

Mel:

Yes, i agree that the topics are vague and that the choices don't cover everything. Again it's pretty outdated. I just like the concept, even if the test itself isn't great. I wish that the two tests could be combined, because the format for the "ISIDEWITH" test is much better but I would like it if it could give results the same way as the other one.

[William one eye]

Dez is just upset his dot showed up in the upper left and now he needs to do some soul searching.




Dez's chart is a more correct veiw of the actual systems

The other chart is a more idealistic view.
And a better representation of what people desire vs what they get.


You cannot give socialized programs without government to run them. They then must manage them.

If they are providing health care then obviously they will pass laws to prevent un healthy activity. Anti sugar, anti tobbacco, antu drugs, anti alcohol, anti processed foods.

I prefer the choice of polluting my body or not.


If they manage finacial welfare, they decide if you can work or not,
If your family members can work, if you get paid or penalized for having children, potetially where you can live, and where you can work.

Obviously energy policys require heavy taxation to build governemnt managed energy. Then I doubt they will give it away free. Or they must force private sector to comply to their standards, in which case they will pass the costs to consumers and price some people out of the ability to use electricity.
Dont belive that . If you get out to certain types of neighborhoods you will see people running extension cords to other peoples houses.

Free speech. Well it works until you might disrupt
Governement management of things.

Guns, if only the givernment has them its much better for the government.

Jails, gonna need more of them.

Races, religions, sexual orientations.
Not important, you are either part of the government or not part of it. Unless thet decide you dont not meet their standards.

Education will teach you the current system is best and not to question it.

This is how communism works. Look at any communist nation.
Its not about power or money for the leaders. its about the ability to effectly govern the system.


What seems to be good intent for all becomes oppression
For all.


Libertarisnism is the opposite.
The more you reduce the governnent the more freedoms you have.

Say what you want, eat what you want, smoke what you want.

However the further you get in this system the more it favors self govenance and requres communities where people are willing to help each other without the government telling them to. Those that cannot help themselves will have to rely on charity of those that want to help. The system also favors alpha behavior, so it will be important to under stand how to defend yourself. Guns are pretty important. To far into this system and it can become lawless chaos.

In general however it is easier to add more government than to reduce it.

However if you get rid of the government entirely the strongest and or smartest will take everything.


I believe we need a smaller governement that expects more personal responsibility of individuals. Drive social change by suporting compaines that agree with your views and pass knowledge and opinions to make it spread.
There are better solutions for almost everything i honestly have never seen the government find any of them.

The government purpose should be to protect the nation, to protect the individual rights of its people and to support infastructure

[Meliva]

I recall an old saying. If all men were saints, there would be no need for government. That being said, since there are bad folks out there, too much government can likewise turn out poorly. Very few things are good or work out when taken to extremes. Moderation is ideal for most things. Don't make things too hot or cold, don't be too nice or too mean, don't give a government too much control or not enough.

I do agree that a good governemnt should mostly concern itself with what Will said. To preserve the nation, it's people, their rights, and the land. It should not however, have to hold the hand of every citizen, and take care of all their needs. If the government handles all the peoples needs, what happens if said government want's to do something that the people are against? Step out of line, and you lose your food stamps and income. If they handle education, well, teach the children to be patriotic, that the government, even when wrong, is still right.

Edit-I will also say that, another old saying, is the road to hell is paved with good intentions. Let's say someone gained complete control over the world, they use absolute power to try to make things good and better. They provide everyone with all their needs, and tries to keep them happy. Then, like with all people, said person dies, and a new person or group takes control. They decide that since they have all the power, they can do what they want, and the people can't do crap about it. Just look at European history with their kings and queens. One king could be loved and a good ruler, but sooner or later, a bad one will show up and ruin everything.